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An insightful look at drone legality in the US

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by oblivie, Jun 9, 2016.

  1. GuyNamedLindsey

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    Good writeup. I almost wasted money on a 333. Glad I didn't.
     
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  2. SanCap

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    Wasted money? I have exactly 25 dollars into getting my 333 exemption.
     
  3. GuyNamedLindsey

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    And you dont need it... so my statement stands. What I was actually referring to though was a lwayer who tried to charge me $2500
     
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  4. SanCap

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    Actually I do need it but would have never paid 2500 for it.
     
  5. oblivie

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    No you don't
     
  6. SanCap

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    The people who pay me say I do and this post will go nowhere so I am done.
     
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  7. GuyNamedLindsey

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    Do what you gotta do. I had one client that made me wear a suit. :D
     
  8. oblivie

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    I will where a t-shirt that says I have 333 exemption lmao;)
     
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  9. RaptorMan

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    It's looking like it's going to take the FAA a lot longer to work this out than I thought. I had expected them to have mostly ironed out the details by the end of this year, but at this rate it might take another century. Imagine working in limbo for many more years...


    Brian
     
  10. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
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    I genuinely have no idea why the FAA is making such a dogs dinner of this.
    It really isn't that difficult and the FAA only need look at other countries frameworks already in place and functioning (like the UK) that have a sensible, legal and workable UAV policy and procedure which has worked for a number of years now.
    It is constantly evolving but the basis has been written into the existing Air Navigation Order and the necessary UAV specific rules are documented and form part of that Order.
     
  11. Ragnar51

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    Luckily, I was able to get my 333 done for free, there were lawyers out there that were charging $3500.00 (just check youtube for confirmation) to do basically what I was able to get done for nothing. Others will disagree no doubt, but I thought the pilots license requirement was a very good idea as it kept the pool to a manageable size and did, IMHO, offer some degree of assurance that the operator knew what they were doing. As I said in another thread, I feel that the 107 requirement of just a written exam will open the door to all sorts of unqualified operators passing them selves off as professionals just as the advent of digital photography has flooded the market with loads of "photographers" who's credentials are mainly in their minds.
     
    #12 Ragnar51, Jun 11, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016
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  12. cdusher

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    I applied on my own and was granted one.
    Cost 0.
    I do find it interesting that the FAA considers an Inspire, Phantom, etc. an aircraft, but as far as I know the U.S. Attorney has not prosecuted anyone for shooting one down.
    So apparently they do not.
    Either it is or it isn't.
     
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  13. Ryan Van Scotter

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    I'm waiting for the FAA to arrest the person hassling a UAV pilot while flying for trying to interfere with a flight crew.

    The FAA wants Integration not segregation!
     
  14. andrew259

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    Anyone watch the drone episode of the good wife?? Very interesting!!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  15. Tcecil

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    "I feel that the 107 requirement of just a written exam will open the door to all sorts of unqualified operators passing them selves off as professionals just as the advent of digital photography has flooded the market with loads of "photographers" who's credentials are mainly in their minds."
    If you fly below 400' and no where near airports, having a pilots license has zero value---The pilot's license may be in your hand but the value of those "credentials" when trying to be an aerial "photographer" are mainly in your mind-
     
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  16. Bryan Conover

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    Truer words have never been spoken when it comes to the glaring contrast in all of this.
     
  17. Dave Armbrust

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    While the article by Jason Koebler is amusing to read it is far from the reality of current UAS laws and regulations.

    His primary argument seems to be "Does the FAA have the right to regulate drones?" He writes "The question of whether or not a drone is an aircraft in a strict legal sense is still unanswered". This has already been clarified in public law. 49 USC § 40102 defines an aircraft as “any contrivance invented, used, or designed to navigate, or fly in, the air.” 14 CFR § 1.1 defines an aircraft as “a device that is used or intended to be used for flight in the air.”

    In all honesty I think we must admit that a UA meets both of these legal definitions.

    On 2/14/2012 the President signed into law the FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012 (P.L. 112-95) which in Section 336 Congress confirmed the FAA's long-standing position that model aircraft are aircraft.

    These are laws folks, not just concepts unsupported by laws. Clearly the FAA has the legal right and responsibility to regulate aircraft.

    Today in order to fly a drone commercially (a 333 waiver) there are many FAA regulations that a UAS operator must ask to be exempt from. The specific regulations are
    14 CFR Part 21, Subpart H; 14 C.F.R. §45.23(b); 14 CFR §§61.113(a)&(b); 14 CFR §91.7(a); §§91.9(b)(2), §91.103(b), §91.109(a), §91.119, §91.121, §91.151, §§91.203(a)&(b); §91.405(a); §91.407(a)(1); §91.409(a)(2), §§91.417(a)&(b); (If interested I will be happy to explain each of these regulations and why they affect UAs.)

    The issues are not simple, while the FAA has put out a notice of proposed rule making (NPR) it is far from perfect. If is does get approved as written it will truly open Pandora's box. (That is my opinion not fact or law)

    If we take Jason Koebler opinion that the FAA can not regulate UAS, then folks we have chaos. (again my opinion) Personally I will chose laws and regulations rather than chaos. By public law Congress has made the FAA responsible for regulating UA. (period)

    Q: Does the FAA have the man power and budget to enforce these regulations?
    A: Not at the present time, or any time in the foreseeable near future.

    Q: Is the FAA moving fast enough?
    A: Depends on your perspective. While I think all of us would like to see them move quicker, I think it is safe to say we also want them to get it right.

    Fortunately we do have a path to operate a drone legally and that is the 333 waiver. While you may not like the process, or the requirements, we do have a path.

    Or, if you prefer, welcome to the wild west where you can do whatever you like, until the law catches up with you.

    On a side note, today, while flying a manned aircraft, I heard Air Traffic Control warn another manned aircraft that a drone was reported at 6,500' 20 minutes ago near his location. (Tampa Florida area). Wild West? Well we certainly do have some cowboys out there!
     
    #18 Dave Armbrust, Jun 11, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016
  18. RaptorMan

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    Bull sh!t! You are like many others with a private pilots license and wanting to exclude those without a private pilots license. As I mentioned before, the USAF has found that it's better to bring in newbies to be drone pilots than it is to retrain pilots -- this is a fact!

    I've mentioned before that there should be a two or three tier system for commercial qualifications and that all of them will require training. A basic qualification should permit most drones to be used in most places but when it involves flying in close proximity to many people, as might be the case when doing a bridge inspection, then a higher level qualification is required. It makes little sense to demand of the geo-mapper or drone operator doing video/stills for real estate work to have the same qualifications as someone flying a camera drone at a stadium sporting event.

    And, for the last time, being a pilot hasn't proven to be all that useful to the USAF for there drone operations! So, cry if you want but there will NOT be a requirement for a private pilots license to fly a drone commercially!


    Brian
     
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  19. SanCap

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    I do not know this for a fact but I assume a USAF drone pilot doesn't need to know a darn thing about airspace classifications or FAA regulations. They are simply trained how to fly then told what and where to go for a particular mission. I do support your 3 tier theory with a stipulation that the UAS operator who has a Pilots License to be at the top of the tier.
     
    #20 SanCap, Jun 12, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2016
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