Welcome to InspirePilots.com

Join the leading DJI Inspire community for free!

How to fly in a "no Fly zone"

Discussion in 'Inspire 1 Discussion' started by World Media, Jul 20, 2015.

  1. World Media

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    102
    Location:
    Kingston, Jamaica
    I hate being told where I can and cannot fly. I don't mind rules and regulation and I don't mind adhering to them but I hate being told by the manufacturer of equipment I have bought where I can use that equipment AFTER I Have bought it.

    That said this weekend I had to fly for a fully sanctioned job at an International airport. The CAA were my clients along with the Airport itself.

    I explained that I couldn't fly at their facility and they were somewhat bemused. But you are fully sanctioned and your aircraft has permission to fly from the tower. You will be in contact with the tower and as a certified helicopter pilot PPLH you are familiar with the radio and airspace protocol.
    No I'm sorry I cant fly DJI say so .... actually when I check I can fly right at the end of the runway right at the threshold where there is arguably the most danger ... but I can fly over the ramps where there is arguably the least. That's because DJI don't apply any common sense to where the no fly zone is ... The epicenter of the restricted zone is skewed at this airport so Bizarrely DJI allow me to fly on an active runway go figure.

    So as a grown man able to use cognitive thought and with permission I had to work out how to fly in a no fly zone. I tried many ways to prevent the gps getting its signal but it would always find satellites. In the end the solution was a simple one. Remove the top cover and disconnect the gps sensor. it was easy, a small connector just pops out. Now the Inspire doesn't know where it is and I am able to fly in ATTI mode.

    The bad thing is that it is always windy, 25 knots ... the inspire handles it with help from GPS. In atti mode it was difficult to maintain the smooth and safe flight I would get with GS hold assistance. I was fully immersed in flying while my cameraman operated the camera.

    It worked but frankly was a struggle and the flight was made considerably more risky by not having the GPS assist. So DJI your forced upgrade and forced no fly zone actually resulted in more danger.
     
    AngelAndres and Kilrah like this.
  2. Mazz

    Mazz Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2014
    Messages:
    944
    Likes Received:
    585
    Location:
    NY
    I understand your disappointment. A no fly zone was actually placed near my house where there was an old sky diving field that is no longer in use. It is now used to store equipment and they have festivals there. Needless to say, I was not happy and also had to find away around it. I did not want to take it all apart so I made a little hat for mine. It is a piece of tin foil I just tape to the top whenever I fly near the old air strip. Works 100% of the time. Looks silly but hey...
     
  3. PB30X

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    Messages:
    419
    Likes Received:
    212
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Velcro and and copper tape work wanders
     
    Michael Millrod likes this.
  4. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,729
    Likes Received:
    3,884
    Hmmmmm....interesting post.
    Whilst I would not condone anybody and everybody overriding the no-fly zones, like you I have CAA approval to fly commercially.
    There are legitimate times (like you have demonstrated) where flying in an ATZ close to an airport might be required.
    The problem DJI have is how they would 'police' a request to 'turn off' the restriction for certified pilots.
    I did wonder whether unplugging the GPS module might have thrown up an error message but I guess not.
    Even easier is Mazz's idea of a tin hat!:p

    Additionally, people should be aware that there is no return to home when flying like this! I know that may sound obvious but it may not be to everyone.

    We would never condone flying irresponsibly and there is the potential for this 'workaround' to allow people to fly in some REALLY stupid places that they should never be!

    With the subject matter of this thread, it could get out of hand so Mazz and I will keep an eye on it.;)
     
    #4 The Editor, Jul 20, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2015
    PB30X likes this.
  5. PB30X

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    Messages:
    419
    Likes Received:
    212
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Worked perfectly fine on my P2, didnt use it on the I1 yet! The whole compass thing pissed me off a long time ago, and learned a few BETA tricks of my own, much on that later. As I don't need DJI knocking on my door
     
  6. World Media

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    102
    Location:
    Kingston, Jamaica
    I tried the Tin Hat approach with no luck, also I was concerned, rightly so, that should the inspire have acquired a gps signal whilst in the air it would have landed immediately with potentially disastrous consequences.
    I, like Ed, also expected GPs disconnect to throw up an error, however it merely didn't establish satellite acquisition.

    Also worth pointing out that the flying was seriously challenging, high winds can see an error or moment of distraction end up in the Inspire being a long way away from you in a couple of seconds. I consider myself a reasonably skilled and aware pilot and trust me I had to concentrate 100% on flying and not monitoring what was on the camera. I had a great camera op to do that for me.

    Ed makes a very good point for anyone who finds themselves in a situation where they have all the permissions and have to switch off the GPS ......... all the failsafes are gone ..... when it gets away t really gets away and there is no home point .... no tracking and you had better be able to fly that thing well ...... It really is not for novices in anything other than perfect conditions.

    As many others have advised on this forum .... Practice in ATTI mode ... because some day your going to lose your gps signal when you least expect it and your going to need it!

    Do not switch off your GPS unless you have full co-operation with the authority that controls the airspace you are flying in. and then take a deep breath grow some huge balls .... and go for it!.
     
    The Editor likes this.
  7. Gregg G

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2015
    Messages:
    141
    Likes Received:
    37
    Location:
    Denver Colorado
    I thought when you switched the Inspire to Atti mode it cuts off the GPS. Or does it?
     
  8. ajohnsonlaird

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2014
    Messages:
    139
    Likes Received:
    56
    There's many a problem solved with an tin foil cod-piece and hat. In this case, just the hat is required, although you could wear the cod-piece for dramatic effect.

    I wrote about this for the ARPAS UK newsletter a couple of months ago. It's really not a good idea for DJI to implement a partial or inaccurate solution -- in the case in point that I wrote about, there is no-fly zone around the White House in DC that's specified by DJI that is a circle of the wrong size and centered around the wrong place compared to the FAA's no-fly zone. They're off by around three miles in terms of the center. Here's what I wrote:

    DJI’s move is heavy-handed, inappropriate, and plain wrong – if nothing else because “DJI is continuing to update its no fly zone list to include sensitive institutions and national borders in compliance with local regulations.” Does DJI have the regulatory authority to do this? What happens if pilots have permission or have been requested by the institutions to overfly them?

    The heavy-handedness and plain wrongness is further illustrated because DJI’s No Fly Zones do not actually match the FAA’s regulations. Let’s take the White House as an example: DJI’s restriction, according to the press release, is “centered on the White House and extends for a 25 kilometer (15.5 mile) radius in all directions.” However, the actual FAA’s Flight Restricted Zone (FRZ, “freeze”) actually extends “approximately 13–15 nautical miles (15–17 statute miles) around the VOR/DME located at the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport.” But the airport’s VOR/DME is 2.69 miles south of the White House, so DJI’s No Fly Zone is not only the wrong size but also is offset by 2.69 miles.​

    Clearly DJI is going to have to have an ongoing maintenance effort to fix the errors in the database and try and keep it current. I hope.....

    I suspect sooner or later they will abandon this no-fly database because, at least in the USA, there are approximately 15,095 airfields many of which are not even in the database -- and these include airfields with commercial traffic, not just general aviation and gliding.

    Andy.
     
    Gary E and The Editor like this.
  9. damoncooper

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2014
    Messages:
    3,457
    Likes Received:
    1,631
    Location:
    Boston, MA
    Try contacting DJI directly
     
    lrwskyfilms likes this.
  10. jon b

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2015
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    129
    Location:
    Chicago
    Not that I've come up against a non fly zone situation but if I did, Im thinking that flying a different A/C without the restrictions (my S800 comes to mind) is the safest way to go... You get GPS and it's RTF function, stable flight in windy conditions. OK not pilot app, but I wouldn't miss that given basic telemetry can still be obtained without it.
     
  11. World Media

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2015
    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    102
    Location:
    Kingston, Jamaica
    GPS is not disabled in ATTI mode it merely is not used for maintaining position.
     
    lrwskyfilms likes this.
  12. rilot

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2013
    Messages:
    1,184
    Likes Received:
    118
    Location:
    Twyford, UK
    Interestingly, you can disable no-fly zones on the A2 FC. I have them turned on on mine as I see no reason for me to turn them off, but they can certainly be disabled.

    Maybe DJI figures that anyone investing in an A2 must be at least aware of the regulations. Interesting that they trust A2 pilots but not Inspire pilots.
     
  13. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,729
    Likes Received:
    3,884
    That is indeed interesting.....
    So what they are saying by implication is that Inspire 1 owners are all destined to appear on the Jeremy Kyle show!
    Great, now where did I put that DNA test?
     
    mdomeny likes this.
  14. mdomeny

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2015
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    50
    i feel offended to be thought because i buy the i1 i am not aware of rukes and regulations... by dji that is the offended part... :D
     
    Michael Millrod likes this.
  15. Richard T

    Joined:
    May 28, 2015
    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    Merced, Ca
    Any chance you could post a picture of your hat..Not sure if I would ever need it but good info to have....
    Thanks
     
  16. Michael1973

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    4
    Not sure what the concern is about? Here is the DJI no fly map; there is only a few places you can't fly. Lol Capture.JPG
     
    lrwskyfilms likes this.
  17. Aviator

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2015
    Messages:
    389
    Likes Received:
    161
    Location:
    Dorset, UK
    t_helmet_tommy.png
     
    lrwskyfilms and The Editor like this.
  18. QuadFlyer

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2015
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    0
    This is ridiculous!
     
  19. jon b

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2015
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    129
    Location:
    Chicago
    Silly post... So you want to fly around airports then? Zoom out just a little (I mean your perspective, not the map)
     
    Scotflieger and lrwskyfilms like this.
  20. Skyringmedia

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Got my cell blocker pouch today from Amazon, took it apart and took the cloth part that blocks the gps signal it works great. I think much better than tin foil. 0 satellites with it over the top. Took it off got full gps signal put it back on and immediately went to 0 satellites.
     
    Michael Millrod likes this.