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UK Training Provider For CAA Permission For Aerial Work

Discussion in 'Inspire 1 Help' started by tweaker, May 29, 2015.

  1. tweaker

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    Anyone got any steers to who's good or not?

    Read through the clear a stud clarification I have assimilated so far-

    On initial approach to researching PFAW Iphoned BNUCS for sub 7kg advice.

    One thing that bothered me was after qualifying was the renew part i.e. next year( it has to be renewed annually)

    Me-"if I already hold the PFAW for sub 7kg once I hopefully qualify why do I need another test for adding another sub 7kg drone?"

    BNUCS-"well its a new industry and not all drones are reliable so we need to test them even if you hold the PFAW and you want to add another drone"

    Me-"so basically you are not testing me its to test the drone?"

    BNUCS-"Yes its a CAA Requirement to ensure safety...."

    Me-"thats funny in CAA regs it sates or word to that effect -"you self certify sub 7kg drones for air worthiness"

    BNUCS"Yes to get our qual you do to go with CAA PFAW"

    Me-" but the thing that entitles you to fly is CAA PFAW...

    Can some one clarify
    1. If I hold BNUCS do I need to go through them to RENEW my PFAW with a further test etc etc

    2.Why am I having to do another test to add another 7kg drone? You still need according to them a flight test to add another craft of the same type to your permission.ie If I have an inspire on PFAW and I want to add another to permissions I need another test.

    I have tried to get clarification from CAA but have had nil response as what to paperwork they require/further testing if I was to DIY a PFAW renewal...

    Can someone layout the way forward-knowledge is power and all that?

    Yours confused
    T

    Ps -I can generally smell waffle and is it just me or is BNUCS capitalising on poor comms from CAA and trying to take my pants down?
     
  2. Scotflieger

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    I am progressing my PFAW with Resource Group and can strongly recommend them. The 3-day Ground School was very comprehensive as was their assistance with preparing the FRCs for CAP 722 templates. I have my flight assessment booked for next week. This will give me the RPQ-S qualification. They will then assists with the PFAW submission to the CAA. They are straight down the line with none of the unnecessary extras I have heard about other NQEs.
     
  3. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
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    Ok - when you say BNUC-s I think you actually mean EuroUSC.

    EuroUSC are the National Qualified Entity (NQE) that award the BNUC-s for both theory and flight assessment and providing you pass both parts (and submit a suitable Ops manual then you will apply with an SRG1320 to the CAA (and pay their fee) who will grant you PFAW.

    It is the PFAW that allows you to work commercially NOT BNUC-s (That's just their version of the certificate of competency if you like).
    As widely discussed on this and other forums, EuroUSC are rapidly falling out of favour with a lot of people due to their arrogance in not complying with implicit instructions from the CAA that states flight assessments ARE NOT required for every sub 7kg SUAV within you fleet.

    What you are being told on the phone is complete utter hogwash. The regulations now state that if you pass a category you automatically qualify for the lower category. In other words, if you qualify for a sub 20kg aircraft then you have automatic permission for sub 7kg as well.
    You DO NOT need to have a separate flight assessment for every aircraft you add providing it is in the same (or lower) weight class. There are exceptions to this but not for the purpose of sub 7kg.

    I would check out other NQE's now (there are quite a few of them) and steer clear of ones who (in my opinion) operate very dodgy business practices!

    In fact, it has become so bad now other entities have spoken to EuroUSC and directly questioned them on their actions. The reply has been "The reason we test every aircraft is for safety reasons and we are very safety orientated" Of course the reality I'm sure is far more financially driven.

    Additionally, you DO NOT have to undergo an annual reassessment (it is not required by the CAA to maintain your PFAW) but you may have to submit your flight logbook for audit (for which there may be a small charge) and you will have to pay the annual renewal fee (currently £113) to the CAA.

    I hope that helps.
     
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  4. IrishSights

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    It's the PFAW is the only thing that really matters to fly commercially in the UK. You can renew your PFAW directly with the CAA but as far as I understand you do not have a renewed BNUC-S if you go the direct route. To get an extra aircraft passed with Euro is not that much more and renewal is the same even if more than one aircraft is in the Ops Manual. Please others correct me if I'm wrong.

    The BNUC-S is useful as they have widespread European recognition if you want to apply in other counties. As I am in Northern Ireland I could well get work in the Republic of Ireland for which I would need a valid BNUC-S hence my Eurosusc route and also at the time they were substancially cheaper. I know other NQEs are accepted in the RoI as well.

    I agree Eurosusc are flapping about over the weight class thing and does annoy me.
     
  5. tweaker

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    Editor

    bang on thank you for sensible advice in laymans terms it is as I suspected.

    There was just to many "probably,maybes" on the phone. Its either yes,no or I don't know as probably or maybe is a non answer.

    I there a specific department/phone number/contact you send the SRG 1320,can you send it electronically pay over the phone in fact so many questions???

    To keep it simple after completing training with whichever training provider I go with what is the way to go about getting a timely renewal the following year.

    I have seen this in other industries where unscrupulous training providers keep their students/potential students in the dark to the process the certification body undertakes to generate extra revenue.

    I found that once the "cat is out of the bag so to speak the Euro USCs of this world so to speak are forced to change their ways. A shot across the EuroUScs of this world is that by that time they are truly a spent force in their chosen industry.

    I suppose you could say in multi rotor training provider parlance that once your propellers are broken they stay broken!!!

    Euro USC take note!
     
  6. Pbaero

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    Did mine win UK with Rheinmetall RTP a serious Defence contractor branching out into UAV training. Very good course in Bristol and several courses held all over UK. Good support as well.
     
  7. richard.dyson1

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    These are the guys going under the name RUSTA?

    I am looking at their course in early August.

    You'd recommend them?
     
  8. Pbaero

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    De
    as they are well funded, experienced, our lecturer Sion had won a DJI award for photos and had a lot of experience in military and civil UAV work
     
  9. lrwskyfilms

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    I went through Resource Group, excellent service throughout IMHO.
     
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  10. tweaker

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    Anyone got any tel numbers for the dept /person who deals with PFAW within the CAA in the UK?

    Very hard to speak to a human being within the CAA dealing with PFAW!!!



    Just
     
  11. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
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    You can give 01293 573700 a try and ask for UAV licensing.
    I can't promise that you will get through though.
    Good luck.......let us know how you get on.
     
  12. lrwskyfilms

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    As above, also try 01293 567171, best of luck.
     
  13. tweaker

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    Editor thanks-Tried number straight to switch board. On transfer straight to answer phone.

    On calling back switchboard switchboard tells me that is THE only number!!

    Try number on and off ALL day-you guessed it straight to answer phone.

    Irwsky- will try out your lead tomorrow.

    Amazing eh? 21st century only 1 phone number that no one picks up and no other way of contacting them.( I would love to be a fly on the wall in the CAA. Bet you any money switchboard operator sits all of 3 and a half yards from the PFAW Dept!!Or at least no more than a 1minute walk away.)

    Or you can send them an email that gives you an automated reply -aka can't be bothered to answer any questions in lo of a reply.

    Scenario 1- Switchboard to PFAW Dept " enquiry on line1 about PFAW"
    PFAW Dept to Switchboard " give him THE direct line"
    Switchboard and PFAW Dept-chuckle,chuckle,chuckle
    Scenario 2- Once naive about all things CAA however getting a really good impression of CAA Professionalism.If it looks like a fish,smells like a fish,tastes like a fish it is a fish.

    Reputations take years to make minutes to lose.I as much as I love my Inspire I am suspecting DJI has infiltrated the UK CAA and implemented a "New" Business model for customer service.

    Oh well........................The quest will continue.

    3 days and counting to speak to someone who can advise.

    Why is doing the right thing so hard?
     
  14. lrwskyfilms

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    Sorry to dash your hopes, I don't know of anyone who's actually spoke to anyone, even after weeks trying, always an answer machine. They're underfunded and do other work as well and still only 2/3 people dealing with the whole UK, and that when there was just 2 companies doing the training, now what 4? 5? plus direct enquiries.

    Best of luck.
     
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  15. tweaker

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    4 Days and counting........
     
  16. tweaker

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    5 Days and Counting.

    Cant be that hard to answer some form of communication in 2015!!

    CEO of CAA Andrew Haines pockets £250,000 Salary and that is not enough to ensure people under him in a Public Body answer the phone/email/carrier pigeon.

    Bet you I would get an answer PDQ if the dept in question was emailed saying they where getting a 50% pay cut!!

    That being said it probably is the old not enough resources/one man doing ten jobs sketch whilst the CEO Pockets ten times the average salary .

    Performance related pay anyone?
     
  17. tweaker

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    6 days.

    It is Sunday bless them.
     
  18. The Editor

    The Editor Moderator
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    They will all be at church :p - Don't forget, Government offices do not work






    Saturday and Sundays that is :cool:
     
  19. tweaker

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    Ok

    Looks like the CAA do not have any communications be it phone/email/whatever.

    Yes they have numbers but no one pick ups/no one can get the dept in question yada yada yada-you get the drift!!Pretty shocking.

    Ok with the state of "No Comms" ONCE you gain your PFAW having gone down the route of using a training provider(that doesn't bend the rules/take advantage of your ignorance in the name of being uber safe-honest its not about ££££) how do you ensure they have your PFAW,are happy with it and it is in the "process" of being reviewed?

    I mean with the CAA "No Comms" issue you may send electronically your renewal and you will not know if they
    1. Have it!
    2.Are processing it!
    3. It may need amended....
    4. And lastly obviously how long prior to its expiry do you send it in?

    If its taking 70-80 days how do you make sure your PFAW Gets renewed before you last one expires? What a cluster ****!!!

    I wonder if the CAA is happy for Airlines to have "No Comms" when the CAA get in touch? Maybe its a new trend in the 21st Century,Airlines operating Aircraft with "No Comms".

    "Good morning Ladies and Gentlemen this is your Captain speaking we currently have no comms with anyone but we will soon be taking off. If you could just listen in to the safety brief.........."
     
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  20. lrwskyfilms

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    Email is the answer, just don't expect a quick reply.